As published here: https://haveyoursay.citizenspace.com/richmondecs/20mph-2018/consult...

and https://www.richmond.gov.uk/media/16482/20mph_consultation_open_let...

The council has opened a consultation on creating a blanket speed limit across the borough of 20mph except on the A316 and A205 (Chertsey Rd and Upper Richmond Rd) to inprove safety.

Whilst I would welcome this on unclassified roads and other areas where there is a greater risk ie around schools and shops, I feel that it will have little effect on other A Roads, and motorists impatience will cause them to sit closer to the vehicle in front or overtake creating a greater potential for accidents to occur.

I may be completely wrong, but that is my gut feeling on this.

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Well there is a 20mph speed limit in Oak Avenue and I can say that I either get tail gated or overtaken on a bend or near parked cars when I am overtaking the parked car.

And that is in the car and on the motorcycle!

I have been undertaken at 20mph in Bushy Park by cyclists.

I would rather the council kept cyclists off the pavement and ensured they use lights at night.

Just been along Oak Avenue, thanks for the warning about the speed limit, signs not too clear. I expected the humps to have been removed, as that stopped you going over 20 anyway, bit of road kill to my mind

x2 Fat Bob, I live in Oak Avenue and have always respected the 20mph limit, both on my motorcycle and in my car, unfortunately the drivers following me are either unaware of the speed limit or are massively impatient as they gesticulate and swerve about pretending to overtake me, I just feel sorry for them.

A recent report commissioned by the Department of Transport, shows no evidence that 20mph zones have any positive effect on road safety because over half of road users feel it is unenforceable and they will not get caught.

20mph report Nov 2018

A blanket 20 mph limit is impossible to police and therefore will be ignored everywhere by the same people who already break the 30 mph limits.

The solution:

Reject the blanket coverage, but set up a very small number only around schools and other genuine higher risk areas.  The limited number could be both enforceable and more likely to be adhered to as there would be a perceived good reason to stick to them.  The fewer 20 mph zones the better for that reason.

Saving the environment:

I have two cars and a motorcycle.  One car was a Band A (but just moved out of that band by the council) while the other is Euro 6 compatible.  Other than electric they are both the least polluting available.  My motorcycle (which I use by far the most) is Euro 4 rated, which is also the least polluting available.  However - they all use more fuel and therefore pollute more at 20mph because they have to be in a lower gear (so the engine revs are higher).  Journey times would also take longer so they would pollute for a longer period of time.

The LBRuT proposal for a blanket 20mph zone is politically motivated and has nothing to do with facts about either safety or the environment.  Reject the proposal on the grounds that there is no evidence to support it's implementation and the vast cost to residents and it's insulting of the Council to pretend otherwise.

Whats wrong with driving at 20? Don't know why people have such a problem with it. It's much nicer to get around Hampton both on foot and in a car without people charging round at great speed. The problem is it's not enforced enough.

Also, I'd like the council to keep cars off the pavement and make sure they have their lights on too! What's happened to parking enforcement too? I guess those who break the law have been moaning and destroyed that enforcement too. 

if it saves kids then I'm game for 20 MPH. you hit a little kid at 30 or 35 mph they're likely to get properly mashed up. 

I agree to an extent Matthew Smith as the benefit of lower speeds in terms of survivability at impact are well-documented. If I had a concern about this proposal is its blanket application to the whole borough.

I would love to see 20MPH on residential roads and streets, but I don't think the benefits of 20MPH on 'main' roads outweigh the loss in efficiency. I'm thinking of the roads that I use to get around: 

  • the A311 north out of Hampton up Hampton Hill High Street heading to Twickenham
  • the A313 east from Hampton Hill to Teddington
  • the A308 to Hampton Court (when it's not dug up by Thames Water)
  • the B358 around the North East border of Bushy Park to Hampton Wick/Kingston

etc. I try to envision these roads at 20MPH and think what's the point.

I have a strong sympathy for cyclist amenability (and if I had to make the case that would be it), but I wonder if that isn't an argument for better infrastructure (segregated cycling lanes etc.) than lowering the speed limit.

Yes, agreed, Matt! Main roads should be 30 but all resi and roads close to schools etc should be 20 - I don't have a problem with this as it will save kids and old people from getting wrecked. Some people tend to break the 30 limit anyway. And if you get caught doing 40 in a 20 then you're in big trouble for dangerous driving and could lose your license - more of a reason to stay under 30!! Speed limits are barely enforced though- I see police (on a number of occasions) doing 30 through Richmond Park (20 MPH zone) with multiple carts following/in front etc. 

Matt D said:

I agree to an extent Matthew Smith as the benefit of lower speeds in terms of survivability at impact are well-documented. If I had a concern about this proposal is its blanket application to the whole borough.

I would love to see 20MPH on residential roads and streets, but I don't think the benefits of 20MPH on 'main' roads outweigh the loss in efficiency. I'm thinking of the roads that I use to get around: 

  • the A311 north out of Hampton up Hampton Hill High Street heading to Twickenham
  • the A313 east from Hampton Hill to Teddington
  • the A308 to Hampton Court (when it's not dug up by Thames Water)
  • the B358 around the North East border of Bushy Park to Hampton Wick/Kingston

etc. I try to envision these roads at 20MPH and think what's the point.

I have a strong sympathy for cyclist amenability (and if I had to make the case that would be it), but I wonder if that isn't an argument for better infrastructure (segregated cycling lanes etc.) than lowering the speed limit.

Reminder that consultation closes this Friday 21 December. Have your say via the links below.

Press release:

https://www.richmond.gov.uk/services/roads_and_transport/roads_and_...

Survey:

https://haveyoursay.citizenspace.com/richmondecs/20mph-2018/

I've lived here for four years and never seen a road accident, speed related or otherwise.

Bath and North East Somerset Council spent £871,000 bringing in the 13 new speed zones a couple of years ago and found that the rate of people killed or seriously injured has gone up in seven out of the 13 new 20mph zones. 

There are children homeless at Christmas this year in the Richmond area. An estimated, 87,310 children in London will wake up on Christmas morning without a permanent home. In London, there is an average of 28 homeless children for every school.

Should we not get our priorities sorted ?

This proposed plan is totally lazy politics.

Get out and decide which residential and near schools roads would actually benefit from this.

I spoke with one councillor recently who accepted that there would be widespread ignoring of this 20 mph limit, with of course attendant random enforcement and fines, bringing the whole thing into disrepute.

It s lazy, headline-grabbing politics by a vacuous leadership trying to show they have arrived. Find something better to show off with.

I wonder if you could reach more than 20mph on many roads in the borough. What with "traffic calming" measures like speed bumps and artificial narrowing of the roads, there can't be many places left. In the evening rush, you usually can only move at a snail's pace.

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